Poor Lulu...Gettin' bullied by both cage mates. At least they don't have a grooming competition on her head, She'd be bald!

She over grooms her own head, always has on and off. She's been bald on her eyebrows for the longest time, I think from being off out of cage routine. I've gotten her out a few times lately, but it looks like it might be starting to grow back now.

So this evening, I placed them at the same food dishes. Ollie was a little brat when the girls came down to check out the floor bowl.


I got some cute photos, try to upload some later. They scattered around and investigated the changes in the cage, then ate some more, lol. Other photos are in a different thread.

The top two feeders are seen in this photo, two are sharing the lower one by the time I got my phone ready to take photos.


Lulu eating from the floor bowl.

Ollie was being his usually fussy self, chasing the girls when they came to or near the cage floor. He was near his bowl and turned fussing, getting ready to chase Lulu away as she approached the fake branch on the floor. I did the "psssst" sound at him. He stopped dead in his tracks and turned and looked at me like "Did you just pssst me?" Of course, he went back to his guarding of the floor bowl and floor I did this a few more times, the second time he also stopped and looked at me, gave me a little stare and then proceeded as usual with his macho floor manager attitude. Skadoosh had stopped on the corner shelf watching and made her way down for a closer look, maybe to see what was going to happen, can't really know for sure with these buggers. Over all, the pssst didn't seem to correct his behavior.

Have you tried using a larger plate that more than one glider can approach without getting in another's way.

The tiny crocks and the small hanging cups in your photos only allow one glider to use the bowl at a time.


A larger shallow plate lets them approach from different angles and not get in each other's way.

Yes, I got one on the 31st of December and tried it. I posted about it, but didn't include a photo. It didn't help. I served the f/v combo, I will not place HPW in a dish that they can walk on. Ollie was not really sharing well most of the time, although they all did at one point get to eat from it earlier on. Later, Ollie controlled the plate, fussing and chasing the girls away. I had to place some f/v in a crock in another location.

I have tried everything, I've used 2-3 feeding stations, I'm currently using three and keeping them from eye's view of each other (for f/v combo, the HPW is a non-issue, I've seen them all drink from the feeder, but never a fuss over it).

When I went back to 3 feeding stations, I had the bowl out on the floor (as seen in photo). I still had trouble with Ollie controlling the bowl, and going up to other feeders, but those he didn't chase the girls away, he ate with them peacefully for the most part. It is really strange. He get's protective over the floor, sometimes even with the toys. I would try the plate again, but I need f/v in more than one location so my girls can access it.

I have also place food earlier in the cage, another method to curb food aggression. This doesn't help either. I can only hope that when the f/v mixture I currently have is gone, I can offer fewer selections each night. I'm thinking 2 veggies and 1 fruit each night, but different combos.

Have to say that I love the idea of using a hammock as a barrier in front of the food dish! Very clever!

Thank you, I've been racking my brain trying to create openess and barrier at the same time. I only wish it was the whole solution. I'm beginning to think my girls will be subjected to his attitude for the remainder of their lives. Has long as no escalation and harm, I can't see separating them. They're all still getting to eat and at times together without issue. I wish I could figure what his trigger is. There are occasional, " your foot is in my face" kind of fuss from one or the other when in pouch, but they never have slept apart from each other. They're fine when playing still, so far as well, except for occasional floor toy dominance here and there, it's mostly with f/v that's an issue, and not always. It's perplexing that all the recommended remedies are ineffective.

Then I'm going to go way out on a limb and say the unusual. Maybe "they" don't really have an issue with the colony dynamics in the cage. Maybe its just you that is uncomfortable with the behavior since you don't fully understand it. If they are all eating well and seemingly get along the majority of the time, then I wouldn't be overly concerned. A bit of dominance here and there isn't unheard of or typically a problem. I would still keep an eye on things to ensure it isn't escalating into a real issue, but I think this just may be the way they are.

That could be true, I don't understand it at all, especially since it started a few months after they were together peacefully and prior to the new cage. It may be that all though the girls Madagascar cage had been cleaned with v/w solution wipe down and steam cleaned (I think anyway) prior to Ollie joining the colony and Ollie's enclosure had gone through a wash maybe scent/ownership from the girls cage here in MD to Ollie's for temporary in AZ, then to a brand new, neutral cage made Ollie vie for dominance. I also wonder if the change in routine is a heavy factor.

Even though they're okay, eating well, normally active and for the most part get along, I can't help but wonder what changed. I will definitely keep an eye on them. I will also make the couple of changes I think could be as possible trigger when I can over a couple of weeks, give or take a few days. This would be the daily food selection and also (hopefully, fingers crossed) back in a routine out of cage play, I've got to get finished clearing out that room, but that's another story.

I don't think life is "equal" in the animal world. There will always be a dominant one. There is always a pecking order. As humans we feel everything should be fair. Unfortunately, getting involved with bickering may just make it worse. My two bicker over food sometimes, but I have learned to stay out of it. They are both growing and are healthy, even though I feel Dot gets more than her fair share. Fiona is active healthy and has always been a bit smaller untill lately. Now they are the same size. So I know Fiona is getting what she needs. They are 6 months oop now.

Over the past week, I've eliminated corn from their diet and have heard less and less bickering. Of course I'm still not sleeping in the room yet, but will be very soon (as early as mid next week) and can keep better tabs on them.

Anyway, I have three containers I mixed their f/v combos in, so I decided to try three variations, none using mixed vegetables, so no corn:

All three contain Bok Choy, Green beans, and some Okra.
Mix one also contains Cucumbers & Strawberries
Mix two also contains Cantaloupe & Honeydew
Mix three also contains Apple & Pear

I plan on occasions to add something different to their meal for more variety, s/a: baby Brussels sprout, peas, grape tomatoes, maybe an orange slice, other green leafy vegetables, and various other f/v when we have them around.

I can't wait till next week when I'll be sleeping in the same room with them and can hear them.

I would include more than just 4 vegetables in their regular mixtures.

Each vegetable is rich in some vitamins and minerals and poor in others. A wider variety will bring a full spectrum of those vitamins and minerals to the nightly feeding.

If you are using mostly bok choi your gliders are missing out on a lot of vitamins and minerals. Adding some spinach or other dark green leafy vegetables which are rich in calcium, magnesium and Vitamins K & A or some carrots for the vitamin A would balance the diet a bit more.

No single vegetable should be more than half of all the vegetables offered in a week.

Thanks Candy, I was trying to use some fruit and vegetables that I saw looked higher in Cal or had higher Ca:p ratio. What I did was make three basic mixes, all including some fav vegetables that were higher in Ca, and each including different fruits for the "daily mix" variety, then alternate a different fruit or vegetable in their serving for the day in addition, every couple or few days.

I chose Boc Choy and Okra because I thought they're higher in Ca, and my babies like them, then I added Cucumber and Green beans because they're also favs around the cage.
I was hoping to have Black berries along with the Strawberries in the berry mix, but the store was sold out of them. I also included Pear with the Apple mix because, they love Apple, and Pear I believed was higher in Ca. The melon mix, well they love melons.

I do plan on adding in more varieties throughout the week, maybe not daily but something every couple or few days added to their "mix of the day". If you think I should add some things in each mix, I can most certainly do that, I want what's best for them, but I thought it was a good idea to add something different not in the regular mix to make it more of a change. I believe we have some frozen spinach around, and I know we have frozen peas, Broccoli and Brussels sprouts, I was planning on alternating adding in one of those throughout the weeks. I was also planning on picking up some Baby Carrots, Sugar Snap Peas, and Grape Tomatoes (my babies love grape tomatoes)and a bag of Baby Spinach or Spring Mix Salad, those are things I like to eat on a fairly regular bases and I figured they could also alternated in the mix throughout the weeks, again maybe every couple of days or so for more variety.

Focus more on offering variety than the ratio of each food. If you are using a good staple that provides adequate calcium the fruits and vegetables round out and bring a full spectrum of vitamin and minerals to the overall feeding.

If you add some additional vegetables to your mixtures it will improve the overall vitamin and mineral content. It appears that you have less vegetables overall than fruit in the mixtures. I would go the other direction and increase the amount of vegetables in general.

Ratios do not indicate how much calcium each food offers - they only show the COMPARISON of the amount of calcium and phosphorus in that particular food.

When offering a mixture many folks think the combination will have more calcium as long as it contains bok choi or papaya. The small amounts of these in a mixture really do not add enough extra calcium to off set the phosphorus in the other foods. Most mixtures end up with the amounts of calcium and phosphorus being close to equal.

Thanks again Candy. I actually have three vegetables and two fruit in each mix, except for the one with strawberries, that one has the cucumber and strawberries added to the Bok Choy, Green beans, and Okra that is in all three mixes. I was going to have the cucumber in all three as well, so there would have been 4 veggies and 2 fruits in each mix & the different item, either veggie or fruit added in every couple days or so:

Mix 1= Bok Choy, Green beans, Okra, Cucumber & Strawberries (supposed to be with Black berries)
Mix 2= Bok Choy, Green beans, Okra, Apple & Pear
Mix 3= Bok Choy, Green beans, Okra, Cantaloupe & Honeydew.

These are basic "mix of the day" variations that will be changed up more when I add another fruit or veggie.

If this plan doesn't work, I will try another way. I'm kind of experimenting, I hope this will work the way I planned it.

They are being fed Critter Love Plus at this time for their nectar staple.

Now about getting to sleep in their room by mid next week, there's been another delay I was so excited today, my mattress had come last Wednesday, a mattress in a box, the box was big, but I thought well it's a 8" full size mattress inside so what I expected. The bed frame arrived yesterday. I couldn't wait to get started finishing and setting up my room. I got the bed frame up and together fairly easy, then came time for the mattress. My brother in-law was here helping my sister with something and luckily he helped me get this box of mattress up to my room and opened it, we pulled it out and it expanded, and expanded and was way to big for the bed frame. Then we checked the box and saw they had sent a KING size mattress And a little bit of after imagining my sister helping with this mattress instead of my brother inlaw, well it wouldn't have been really that funny. So, anyway, he helped me return the mattress, and I got my money back, and ordered it again

Today I'm going to discuss a little about their food, but mostly update on their tent time.

I've been sleeping in the same room with them for less than a week (since last Wednesday), and they've had two tent times play so far.

The first I believe I discussed in their thread about adjusting with traveling across country and settling in or the tent time play thread I started.

So I believe they've completely settled in, and I'm mostly settled in, but still work to do. As I am sleeping in the same room, I do hear skirmishes here and there. I don't know if there is more when I'm not in the room for some time in the earlier part of the evening, or if sometimes late night to early morning I'm in a deeper sleep and somehow miss it. I think my being in the room, and more importantly being in better routine, may beginning to improve things. Too soon to tell for sure though.

The second tent time play was this morning, I have hung a fleece, braided vine on two plastic rings I stitched in after the first morning play. I included another hanging toy this morning, well let the photos explain, sorry I was so close to the toy. This is the best I have of the hanging set up.


At most there were two at a time on there, or just one, I couldn't get more than one at a time because being so close to toy. I'm planing on hanging some fun dangling toys from there as well some times. And when I can, add their play gym in there (when I have room to keep it here at the house).

They had a ball

After a while though, Ollie went into attack mode on my ear, and even got my face. Ouch, I don't know what he is doing or why. At first I thought it was due to boredom when I didn't have toys in there, but the last two times I have and he still finds his way to attack my ear, and this morning he nipped my hand/fingers twice as well. I'm hoping this behavior changes after regular tent time plays continue routinely. It may be that he just hasn't had the time to bond with me like the girls have had, with the moving and lacking of out of cage play time for several months.

Now for food. I've mentioned my three mixtures and how I plan to vary those a few times per week. So, night before last I cut up an orange slice, I only offer citrus and tomato occasionally, and also included peas with their melon mix. They absolutely loved it What a big hit, they ate every morsel of their f/v that night, hardly a inkling there was any food in their dishes at all. Usually, they leave some bits behind.

This leaves me to ponder what they think when such yummy rare treats show up in their food dish.

This is an update on an Ollie moment only.

Ollie was up early, like before 3pm, looking around for a snack. I was just finished cleaning their drop tray, which maybe roused him, but he usually gets up a little early and sometimes too early now and then.

My hands probably still had the vinegar smell on them from the cleaning solution I use, lol. But he licked my hand like it was full of yummyness. I was able to coax him onto my hand after some effort and let him run up to my shoulder. I brought him downstairs to offer him a craison, he didn't want it, just wanted to lick my neck. Then I broke out a vanilla yogurt, he wanted none of that either, just kept licking away on my neck, lol. And the best part is he didn't even go after my ears.

It was a nice special Ollie visit.

Ollie boy went on a little field trip to the kitchen with me yesterday. He didn't even attack my ear this time, I think he thought about it, but was overwhelmed with the traveling that he lost interest in my ear. lol. I had been doing some house cleaning and when replacing my clean sheets on my bed, I noticed Ollie out of his pouch and realized it was close to feeding time (a bit after 4pm). I stopped what I was doing and was going to just go get the food, but as I past the cage he came to the door to greet me, and I decided while saying hello to just let him come down with me to get their food. It took only a few seconds for him to climb onto my arm and up my shoulder, then onto my back, after he peed on my shoulder He piggy-backed the whole way down, but once I reached the kitchen he was on the shoulder and taking in the "kitchen wonderland". I got their food dishes out, then their food from the fridge and as I was serving it up in the dishes, I handed him a green bean. He was so cute with his green bean, he just sat on my shoulder, holding his green bean and was contently eating it and continued to do so until we reached upstairs and approached the cage. When I peeked at him, he was just holding the green bean in his mouth for transport to the cage. He readily went back into his cage with green bean in his mouth and finished eating it on the hammock as I placed the dishes inside.

I really think he's enjoying these excursions.

It's fun when they hitch a ride! Fiona went with me once to the fridge to get mealies. When I opened the fridge door it startled her so bad she jumped off and landed on the floor. Then we both went into panic mode. I took a deep breath, put my arm out palm down and asked her to come to me. She didn't need any coaxing. She ran up my arm dove into my shirt and I got the mealies out of fridge, opened up the cage door. And when she heard the latch, out she came and went obediently into the cage to wait for mealie. Like it never happened. We have made the trip since then and when I get near the fridge she hides under my hair on the back of my neck.

Awe, how sweet.

So since I have gotten permission to use the "shared" bathroom for glider out of cage time, I've had them in there twice. The first was early Sunday morning for a short time, and then again this morning, we had a little over half an hour. I bought a new small pirate ship for them to explore, they did, briefly. Mostly they groomed me, but did venture around and seemed to enjoy. I had to download night light apps on both of my tablets, lol since the one I made for them originally is in storage still.

Anyway, Skadoosh did more climbing than she has in a long time and I enjoyed their play time much better than in the tent.

Another thing happened that surprised me, all three gliders returned to me when I called their name. Lulu on two separate occasions. Of course I called their name several times before they returned, but not an extreme amount of times. I can't be certain it wasn't coincidence, but I'll see if it happens again next time. First I did it with Lulu, when she ventured around the toilet where I couldn't see her, I called her name a few times, like you'd call a kitty to you, she came around and over to me and climbed right up onto me, this happened again when I called her a second time a bit later, she was on the other side of the bathroom, near the bathroom door and I could see her. Skadoosh was by the bathroom door also, but at a different time, I called her name the same way a few times and she came to me and climbed up onto me as well. Ollie was around the other side of the toilet where Lulu had been when I called to him and he came to me the same as the girls. Has anyone had their gliders return to them when called by name? I can hardly wait to see if it happens next time.

"Here Lulululululu"? Sorry, my imagination has made this pretty funny

My gliders do not come when i call. Well, they come to the door of the cage if they are awake and feel like it. Outside of the cage i have to wave a feather cat teaser around. Or go to them.

LOL, no it was more like just repeatedly calling Lulu. She's done it a few times since, but this morning at playtime she ignored me.

And speaking of play time. I had been pretty sick all last week so didn't get them out for most the week. My schedule permits me to adopt a three mornings a week for out of cage play. Typically Monday, Wednesday, and Saturday mornings. I'm hoping the regular routine will help with Lulu's over grooming her eyebrows (above her eyes really). Anyway, I missed Monday and Wednesday last week because of feeling too sick and I'm late on cage cleaning. Today I was beginning to feel a little better, so I got them out for morning play time.

I've been having it in the bathroom and they are loving it. The girls, both Lulu and Skadoosh really have been exploring, climbing and jumping back to me like crazy. Ollie has some in the beginning, but the last two times he's spent most of the time on me, while the girls have seem more eager to run about earlier on. Anyway, I felt bad because a few times the girls would jump to something they couldn't grip and dropped to the floor. They weren't hurt, continued with activity for the duration and enjoyed pine nuts and a little last minute foraging around the cage before going to bed for the day. This evening they were all out acting normal. One of the things Skadoosh jumped to was the door, it's wood, and I wonder if she thought it was a tree. She wasn't able to grip it and slid down to the floor. Then both girls took turns jumping to the medicine cabinet door, and of course slid down and dropped to floor. Silly girls.

We still have the squabbles over the fruit/veggie bowls, but they share everything else nicely (pellets, mealies and of course the nectar). With two bowls on opposites sides of the cage and one on floor and one on top shelf, the girls have opportunity to eat, no one is starving. But yet, they seem to keep going to the bowl Ollie wants for himself. I'm beginning to not feel so sorry for them anymore because they keep going back to bother him. I haven't seen anything else that disrupts their relationship with each other, so I've stopped being overly concerned about it for the most part, unless it escalates.