GliderCENTRAL

Vetiquette

Posted By: sugarlope

Vetiquette - 07/15/09 04:07 AM

After my visit with my vet today, I realized that we talk a lot about what we should expect from our vets, but we don't talk very much about what our vets should be able to expect from us.

I took Kira in for an exam today and my vet commented on how nice my kids were and how much easier her job was because I could help hold them and keep them under control.

While vets are there to help us with our animals through crisis or through routine wellness exams, there are several things that I think we can strive to do to make office visits go smoothly;

Make sure nails are trimmed before the examination. If it is not an emergency situation, I always trim nails the morning before I go to see the vet. We are (more) used to glider's nails and most of us can probably tolerate them longer than non-glider owners. If nails are trimmed, handling and manipulating them is easier during the examination because neither myself nor the vet are having to constantly pull tiny pins out of our fingers (arms, shirts, pouches, face, etc.) I think it is important to trim the nails the day before or day of a visit.

Learn how to handle your gliders so you (and other's) don't get bit. Ok, while vets are more used to being scratched and bit, it is not actually their job, and in fact these things make their job more difficult to carry out.

I don't care how well trained a vet tech is, most vet techs that have not dealt with small animals (and even some who have) do not know how to hold a sugar glider without someone getting bit. We are the people that know our own gliders the best. We know their mannerisms, we know their sounds, their attitudes and we should all try to learn how to handle them for a vet if the need arises. I know that friendlier gliders are generally easier to handle, but several of mine will bite if they feel they are being messed with and one of them will bite very hard because he can. (Ok not really, of course there are reasons such as fear and protective instincts behind the behavior, but I think you know what I mean).

I have seen several posts about vets putting gliders under to do a simple exam and how upset some people get about this procedure. The reason this often occurs is because they don't want to feel like a pin cushion, nor should they have to. If we can all learn how to handle our own gliders, then hopefully that won't be a risk we have to take as often.

Ways to handle an upset glider, you ask? These are a few ideas;
-Keep fingers and other skin away from their mouth. This seems obvious, but try to keep it in mind.
-Always remember fleece is your friend (but remember too that an angry glider can bite through 1-2 pieces of fleece).
-Trimmed nails make it easier to hold onto a glider in fleece.
-If you immobilize the head, they can't get their mouth to your skin, or the vet's.
-Give them something to hold onto with their hands/feet when you can, especially when you are holding their head, this keeps them from getting quite as panicky.
-Keep your eyes on your glider. If you look away and start talking instead of paying attention to their movements, you are more likely to lose control of them. You will often find that they are looking at you too. I find it is more comforting to them to have your attention on them than looking elsewhere.
-If you are losing control of them, let the vet know BEFORE you release your glider. All hands off, take a break, let them walk around for a second or two and then pick them up and try again.
-Always give treats, scratches/rubs, or some kind of reward when you are finished holding them.

Make sure to have all pertinent information with you. When you make an appointment (non-emergency) sit down the day before and go over any changes in their behavior, activity level, appetite, weight, appearance or symptomology that has recently occurred for each glider that will be seen. Write things down to help you remember (especially dates and number of days for symptoms, etc.) It can be as easy as writing significant changes down on a calendar as they happen, with the gliders name to help you remember along the way.

Remember to be nice. I know not all vets are as knowledgeable as others, and it can get frustrating, but try to remember that most of them are there to help if they can. There may be a limit to their knowledge, but getting angry with them is not going to help the situation and may just result in them no longer listening to you. If they are not comfortable with sugar gliders, take consult vet #'s with you, just in case. Most veterinarians are willing to learn. If you find one that you cannot work with or are uncomfortable with, however, it is always your right to search for another vet.

I think having a good relationship with your vet is important, regardless of what kind of animal you have.
Ok, that's it, I'm off my soapbox. tounge

If anyone has anything to add, though, please do! grin
Posted By: LSardou

Re: Vetiquette - 07/15/09 05:06 AM

Excellent points Gretchen! Thank You!!!
Posted By: TracieB

Re: Vetiquette - 07/15/09 05:26 AM

Great post Gretchen! thumb I'm gonna print it out and keep it handy cause those are all things I need to be doing more consistently.

Thanks for taking the time to write this up for all of us. wink
Posted By: tammyangel

Re: Vetiquette - 07/15/09 05:35 AM

Great Post Gretchen.
Posted By: Dancing

Re: Vetiquette - 07/15/09 05:56 AM

Excellent post. Needs to be a sticky.
Posted By: StitchsMom

Re: Vetiquette - 07/15/09 12:09 PM

Great post! thumb
Posted By: vagraphix

Re: Vetiquette - 07/15/09 12:29 PM

Great post!

I do that! My vet always comments on how easy it is to get exams done on my gliders. He even commented that I should be on call to handle all his glider patients...LOL

Seriously our vets really DO appreciate the owners being able to control and restrain our own fuzzies so that they can get thier jobs done easily and quickly.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Vetiquette - 07/15/09 01:10 PM

That wasn't a soap box - it was a "need to know" talk for all of the glider owners that care to be curtious to our very much needed Vets -

Thank you for reminding us -

Sue
owned by
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Vetiquette - 07/15/09 01:10 PM

smile that was a great post!!!
Posted By: sugarlope

Vets and handling your gliders - 04/08/11 05:39 PM

I have read several responses to different threads while reading over archived threads and I feel like something needs to be said. I have seen over and over where experienced glider owners tell new owners that if the vet doesn't handle a biting glider with a smile on their face and a perfectly cool demeanor, then they are not a good vet...ok roflmao yes, I am exaggerating.

But I do see posts about people being upset that a glider isn't handled the way they would like/expect by a vet or that some vets will anesthetize a glider to thoroughly examine them, or the gliders were not thoroughly examined because they were biting, flipping out, etc.

So I say again - and yes, I feel this way about all animals, not just gliders: Veterinarians went to school not to learn how to take a bite from our animals, but to help us help our animals when they are sick, or need preventative care.

If we expect our gliders to receive good, thorough care then we need to learn to advocate (and be willing to pay for) the care we expect (fecals, UA, anal gland check, body condition, respiratory, heartrate, etc.) when it is needed. But we also need to learn how to handle even the most aggressive of our gliders so the vet can thoroughly check them over and be sure that all is ok - OR - we need to request (yes, I said it) or at the very least, accept that our glider(s) be anesthetized so that proper care can be given.

I have had a lot of unhappy critters enter my life that I have taken to the vet. I received several abused reptiles, some of whom were quite angry and aggressive because of their history and/or the injuries they were suffering. I have taken in local cats who were injured and untame but their owners didn't care to pay for the vet bill or even bother to take the animal to the vet to begin with. And I have handled gliders, my own (a few of which didn't know me nor trust me very well) and others who didn't know me at all.

Especially when dealing with an animal that is not under control, I will, at the very least, help to control an animal and put myself next to the mouth if that is not the part that the vet is trying to examine at the time. But most often, I will get and maintain control of the animal myself while a vet does the full examination. If I start to lose control, I let the vet and techs know to back off until I can regain control and be assured that no one (hopefully, but not always myself included) will be injured.

Now let me be clear - I DO NOT like to get bit, and I have been bitten by a lot of different animals over the years. I have even had a few really badly infected bites, but I know my vets don't like to get bit either. And I know that they need to have their hands in good condition to examine the next patient. I would be pretty upset if someone went in ahead of me and my vet got injured so they were not available to treat my animal when I needed - and I wouldn't be upset with the vet. shakehead

The relationships I have with all of my vets is absolutely wonderful because they know what to expect from me and my animals because of how I handle them when we are there. They know that they don't take on the risk of accidentally injuring my tiny little gliders because they don't handle them every day like I do. They know that they can examine one of my animals thoroughly with very little risk to themselves.

My point - Please, please, please, learn to handle your animals. Most sugar gliders will never like to be held. Of those that happily allow it, very few will tolerate being happily restrained for the time a decent examination takes.

Realize that if you learn how to handle your gliders, you will reduce the likelihood that your glider will inadvertently be injured because of hands inexperienced in handling your gliders. There will be less stress for your gliders because they are more used to your scent and hands (even if they are pretty new to you) which automatically makes them a little more comfortable/relaxed. The exam will go much faster and smoother (which means it is all over for them in a blink). It will lead to better, more complete examinations, because your vet has both hands to palpate, look, use instruments, etc. and is only focused on examining your glider, not focused on getting through as fast as possible so they don't get bit again. It will also lead to a much better relationship with your vet as well as increasing/solidifying your vet's confidence in your care and concern for your animal. And (for all of us who know how expensive vet care can be) - all of my vets give me breaks on price here and there, sometimes writing off entire procedures/visits. The people I know who have animals that bite their vets - NEVER do. roflmao
Posted By: FuzzierThanMost

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/08/11 05:55 PM

THANK YOU for writing this!
At my first vet visit, my daddy glider went for his checkup before his neuter, he was so good the hour and a half ride and for the vet tech, not a peep not a nip. when the vet took over he burritoed him but he got loose, so daddy clung to him and the vet goes "how do you get these things off you?!" with a smile on his face as he like grabbed him by the scruff. I didnt like that but I didnt get upset because I had refused to get him gassed so he was just trying to do his best. I took over and during the examination daddy hung on to me which made him feel so much better, the vet got a nice nip but I took about 7.

As owners, we might have the most experienced vet ever, but we still live with our animals, we really know them. If we feel like we should, we should speak up!

For the good of the glider <3
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/08/11 06:35 PM

I think it is crucial that we, as owners, take an active part in the veterinary exams. Gliders are high-stress animals by nature. Then here we go packing them off in the middle of the day, to an unseen place that smells funny, for someone new to touch them and poke them. Is it any wonder there's some chompers? Having a familiar hand hold them shows the glider at least some familiarity.

I think properly handling your pet also demonstrates to the vet your responsibility and caring as an owner.

Gretchen you make a very good point about the next patient. Any break in the skin is an opportunity for infectious disease. Yes, vets wear gloves, but, why invite the germs in if it can be avoided?

There are certain situations where a glider will be unruly. If you have a new glider in your home that isn't tame, it is only fair to alert your vet of this. He or she may schedule your glider after they've done their surgeries in the morning so that their work is not hindered by a swollen joint.

The best way I know to hold a glider is this: flipped over on their back, with your fingers wrapping around their side, holding an arm down, thumb resting under the chin. Let their other hand hold onto you (they will naturally). In this position, you can swab a pouch, cloaca, take heart rate, or administer meds.
Posted By: oakley

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/08/11 06:46 PM

I had to bring in my gliders for a hello visit just to re-assure my vet that they weren't absolute demons. As soon as he realized that I was in complete control of my gliders, and that any of my guys would behave themselves (at least to some extent) he readily accepted me as a new client.

Let's face it. There is a reason why gliders are regarded as horrible, biting, terrifying little creatures among vets, and we have to do our very best to make their job as easy as possible!
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/08/11 06:53 PM

I agree with all of this, but I also believe that if a vet shows evident fear in handling your animal/s and even more fear of the animal's mouth, it's time to find a new vet. Your vet should be comfortable with not just your animal, but all animals.
And good bedside manners a must.
Posted By: JillMarie

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/08/11 07:37 PM

Great post Gretchen! And I agree with you 100% in fact my vets are quite happy I help and I even trained one vet's assistant on a better way to hold a cat still during an exam.

But I also agree with Megs on this one. If a vet shows a real fear of an animal, then move on. There is a difference between not wanting to get bit, and fearing it so much the animals sense it. I am very comfortable around animals, even though I dont want to get bit either. But I dont fear them and I expect similar from the vet.

It is important for every animal caretaker to be able to handle their animals, and for the animals to be handled. This helps with something a simple as removing a stuck nail from the pouch, trimming nails, and holding the animal for the vet during an exam.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/08/11 08:09 PM

Great post! I'm sure the vets appreciate it!
Posted By: sugarlope

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/08/11 10:38 PM

While I agree that outright fear is of concern - that's not really what I'm talking about here, and it is not something that I have seen or heard of often. I'm talking about people being upset that their gliders might be sedated when the glider is not easily handled or restrained. Even the nicest, sweetest gliders do not like to be restrained by someone they don't know. When a glider is restrained and scared, it's only recourse is crabbing, flailing, scratching, biting, whatever it can do to get loose. Likewise, even if a tame glider is running around on the vet, it is going to be difficult to examine them very well.

Something else to consider, if an owner is afraid of them or of handling their own glider, the glider(s) reacts to this just as much as the fear they (may or may not) sense from the vet.
Posted By: SGQ

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/08/11 11:22 PM

I agree with your post Gretchen!

~~ I muzzled my elderly dog when I took him into the vet for a possible illness. He had gotten pretty mean in a short ammount of time and I thought he was sick (I was close, he had a blockage and was in pain)..

My vet worried about *why* I muzzled him. Truth is, if I feel there is even the slightest chance one of my animals is going to bite (whether it be fear or pain..) it's not the vet's job to take those bites. (The size of the animal doesn't matter!)

I laughed a little when they came in wearing gloves with my rescue, but I sure as heck don't blame them one bit! I made it clear I had just got her and barely handled her so they *knew* the hiccups we could experience in her checkup before they happened.

Now a vet outright *hitting* your animal~ no way. Said it in the other thread too.. Twinkie trying to chew his incision and my old vet thumped him. I was ticked off to say the least.

There are certain handlings to be expected (preferably you do the manhandling of your own animal)~ but there is certainly a line as well.
Posted By: angelic4296

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/09/11 12:21 AM

I have been one of the lucky ones over the years. My vet sees gliders often, he's really the only one in my area that sees them, so everyone goes to him (there is another vet in the same practice that also sees them, she's great too). He is very familar on the way to handle them (flipped over, thumb under chin) and my gliders have never been too aggressive with him, thank God.

However, I too help with the exam, especially with Ruthie, who can be nippy even with me sometimes (Gizzy will let anyone handle him, he's a lovebug). I usually hold each glider while he palpates them, listens to the respiratory system etc. I also hold them for the x-ray they both get, which I insist they get everytime to look at bone density and check for crystals in the kidneys and bladder. My vet and I have a great relationship because he knows I'm going to do my best to help make his job easier and in return he helps me by doing a very thorough exam and not charging me an arm and a leg haha.

I have also had the same experience as Gretchen in terms of being charged, I noticed that since I started handling my gliders during the exam, certain tests mysteriously "disappear" and don't ever show up on my bill lol....woot!! smile
Posted By: Gizmogirl

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/09/11 11:51 AM

Wonderful thread! clap
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/09/11 12:40 PM

I, like Jess, also try and get "right up in there" at exams. It's not that my vet is "scared" or "nervous" about handling them...most times he knows my gliders are more comfortable with ME and will suggest or ask that I hold them so A) he has both hands free and B) he doesn't like seeing my gliders go nuts and stress out any more than I do. So if one of my gliders is more relaxed being handled by momma, the exam goes MUCH smoother and less stress on the glider.

Plus I always have treats with me... smile

Sometimes I get arrgravated at the vet assistants, esp if they are new and don't really know gliders. They are the ones who act nervous or tell me "Uh why don't you hold the animal, I don't want to get bit."
Posted By: sugarlope

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/11/11 02:55 AM

Originally Posted By: SGQ
Now a vet outright *hitting* your animal~ no way. Said it in the other thread too.. Twinkie trying to chew his incision and my old vet thumped him. I was ticked off to say the least.

Yep, I would not tolerate a vet hitting my animal either. It wouldn't be a vet I would revisit. shakehead
Posted By: MeganC

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/21/11 04:51 PM

Could someone post a picture of the proper way to handle gliders? I think I know what you're describing, but I'd rather be sure than sorry. Wicket's going to the vet tomorrow...
Posted By: SeemsFamiliar

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/27/11 07:20 PM

Yes, a photo of a glider being held would be great. When mine are grumpy I can safely get them from here to there, but if we have to do something they are upset about the blanket trick is the best I can pull off. I'm not the best at actually controlling a burrito either and I've seen photos of that.
Posted By: eshaw

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/28/11 09:19 AM

"But we also need to learn how to handle even the most aggressive of our gliders so the vet can thoroughly check them over and be sure that all is ok - OR - we need to request (yes, I said it) or at the very least, accept that our glider(s) be anesthetized so that proper care can be given."

This isn't such a bad idea when you stop to think about it. There is WAY LESS stress on the animal. A thorough examination can be conducted, teeth examined and nails trimmed also.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/28/11 09:57 AM

Originally Posted By: sugarlope
Originally Posted By: SGQ
Now a vet outright *hitting* your animal~ no way. Said it in the other thread too.. Twinkie trying to chew his incision and my old vet thumped him. I was ticked off to say the least.

Yep, I would not tolerate a vet hitting my animal either. It wouldn't be a vet I would revisit. shakehead


It would take everything in me to not hit him back.
I get snotty when people even diss my animals with me right there. Those are my babies gosh darn it!
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/28/11 01:10 PM

Originally Posted By: SeemsFamiliar
Yes, a photo of a glider being held would be great. When mine are grumpy I can safely get them from here to there, but if we have to do something they are upset about the blanket trick is the best I can pull off. I'm not the best at actually controlling a burrito either and I've seen photos of that.

If no one posts a pic before my daughter gets home, I will. Kinda hard to take a pic with my chin! LOL!

Great post and very much needed!
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/29/11 06:26 PM

My little Roo. Notice his right hand holding my finger. And right foot, holding my hand! His left hand down by his side, out of the vet's way.
Posted By: FuzzierThanMost

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/29/11 07:26 PM

awww
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/30/11 04:09 AM

Perfect pic Connie! Just what I was trying to describe!!!!
Posted By: suggiemom1980

Re: Vets and handling your gliders - 04/30/11 04:18 AM

Originally Posted By: lovely1inred
Perfect pic Connie! Just what I was trying to describe!!!!

LOL! I'll tell Roo he did a good job!
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