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Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Judie] #799475
06/27/09 12:06 AM
06/27/09 12:06 AM
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Sheila Offline
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I see many statements here that need correcting. First starting with Mac. Starting on June 3 I decided to add some names to the Pet Glider Data Base. When I started to see the errors, I decided to try and get them corrected. I actually only entered about 5 of my gliders to that database. Many were already added by different people and the lineages were incorrect. In a conversation with Priscilla on the phone just prior to me making these corrections, I told her why the database was wrong giving her two examples - the one about Minnie and Mickey not being out of Ethan and Eileen and the one about Mac not being a platinum. Priscilla had no idea that Ethan was not always with Eileen. She had put in the database that Mac was a platinum and I reminded her that Mac had always produced normal colored gliders and Mosaics. Mac was described to me by Dai, the previous owner as a mosaic.

Nicole, I don't know what you are referring to about another platinum I have produced from a different line. Also, All of Bec's platinum are from Haley lines.

Judie, the glider that Jason purchased from me was a Mosaic 100% Het for Leu, 100% Het for Platinum out of Haley's line. She was Haley's granddaughter.


ToandFro Gliders

http://www.toandfrogliders.com

USDA Licensed breeder for 12 years and counting!

WE SELL THE STEALTH WHEEL
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Sheila] #799479
06/27/09 12:15 AM
06/27/09 12:15 AM
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Posts: 20,093
North Central Ohio
GliderNursery Offline
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This dilemma seems so easy to me to fix.

A "True Platinum" would be called a Platinum. This refers to the genetic coloration that everyone understands. (As indicated before, because Platinum is a genetic term it should only be used on a glider with that lineage.)

A "Platinum colored Mosaic" would be called a Silver Mosaic. This is the color only, just like a white mo, or a ringtail mo. That description tells everyone what color the mosaic is and speaks nothing of genetics (other than being a mo).

Let's face it, the platinum-color is silver. Why try to re-invent the terms? The mosaics in question are silver, why not just call them that?


Last edited by GliderNursery; 06/27/09 12:15 AM.

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Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Sheila] #799508
06/27/09 01:50 AM
06/27/09 01:50 AM
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Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
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Originally Posted By: Sheila

Nicole, I don't know what you are referring to about another platinum I have produced from a different line. Also, All of Bec's platinum are from Haley lines.


Annabelle, from Caspian and Magnolia.

Also, Becca's gliders don't have Haley anywhere in their lineages.


~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Guerita135] #799517
06/27/09 03:02 AM
06/27/09 03:02 AM
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Sheila Offline
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Bijou is Bailey's brother on the father's side, Piffin is Lil Dipper's sister and on the mother's side, Cereal is there.
Also if you look at Caspian, he has Frodo on his side and also Mum is on Caspian's side and he is out of Blanch a Champagne platinum. I actually think Blanch looks more like a platinum than Silverbell because of her stripe color.


ToandFro Gliders

http://www.toandfrogliders.com

USDA Licensed breeder for 12 years and counting!

WE SELL THE STEALTH WHEEL
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Sheila] #799616
06/27/09 02:20 PM
06/27/09 02:20 PM

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So, how about silver mosaics for the mosaics that are born that way, and powdered mosaics for the ones that powder out eventually. ??

It really would be helpful if we could come up with something to clear up the confusion for sure.

Guess time will tell!

Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: ] #799628
06/27/09 03:38 PM
06/27/09 03:38 PM
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Ok
Sheila Offline
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I think Platinum colored works fine. I am sorry there are those that don't like it, but we can't please everyone.
Platinums don't become platinums over time. They are born with it. It is a gene just like a Leu gene and the hets look like normals. If anyone has any question as to whether something is platinum, please email me for verification.


ToandFro Gliders

http://www.toandfrogliders.com

USDA Licensed breeder for 12 years and counting!

WE SELL THE STEALTH WHEEL
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Sheila] #799638
06/27/09 04:17 PM
06/27/09 04:17 PM
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 11,583
Sycamore Illinois
Karin Offline
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See, this is why I am confused Sheila. If you get a chance, please go look at my thread titled Powdered Mosaic.

You said this earlier in this thread:


"Sil many gliders that are mosaic don't start out as platinum, but become that when they powder out. The breeder can then go back and change it. Not all mosaics powder out."


It seems what you just said seems to be the opposite.

I really am confused!

Karin


Miss Lily and Bud
Prada and Armani
Tessa, Deuce and Cami

Tira and Misu angel Deja and Vu

Glider Daydreams



"Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass...It is about learning to
dance in the rain!"
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Karin] #799652
06/27/09 05:29 PM
06/27/09 05:29 PM
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Ok
Sheila Offline
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Karin in my post I was referring to a platinum glider, not a mosaic one.


ToandFro Gliders

http://www.toandfrogliders.com

USDA Licensed breeder for 12 years and counting!

WE SELL THE STEALTH WHEEL
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Sheila] #799656
06/27/09 05:50 PM
06/27/09 05:50 PM
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St. Johns, Florida
Srlb Offline
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Sheila, I had asked over in the other thread a question as well. Hopefully you will be able to clear it up for me.

Karin stated that you once told her there was platinum in Prada's line...I looked over Pandoras lineage (Pradas daughter) and I do not see where that would be so. Hoping you can explain it to me so I can understand this stuff a bit better. As I thought only Haley and Silverbelle were the only *true Platinum* lines.

Also, You said you were referring to a platinum glider not a mosaic one, but the part that Karin has highlighted looks like you were talking about a mosaic...

(Slapping myself because now I am confused...thanks Karin... :P)


Peggy
Critter Love
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If you want to know what a person is like, watch how he treats others.

You'll never know what the outcome is if you don't step up and try.

Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Srlb] #799664
06/27/09 06:14 PM
06/27/09 06:14 PM
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Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
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Maybe I'm reading it differently, but it looks like what Sheila is saying is that platinum-colored MOSAICS don't always start out that color, but rather they will powder out to the platinum color as they get older. However, TRUE PLATINUMS do not powder out. They are OOP as platinums.


~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Guerita135] #799670
06/27/09 06:30 PM
06/27/09 06:30 PM
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 11,583
Sycamore Illinois
Karin Offline
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That works for me, however, calling them Platinum Mosaics (once they powder out), is extremely confusing.

dunno

Karin


Miss Lily and Bud
Prada and Armani
Tessa, Deuce and Cami

Tira and Misu angel Deja and Vu

Glider Daydreams



"Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass...It is about learning to
dance in the rain!"
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Guerita135] #799673
06/27/09 06:31 PM
06/27/09 06:31 PM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 841
Houston, Texas
gliderboy4life Offline
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Yes you are correct Nicole, that is what Sheila is saying.

Also, we believe the Haley platinum line is coming from Cereal which was passed down to Bailey(Haley's dad). So Peggy if your glider has any cereal/frodo there is a possibility.

Also, after talking with Susan(FFR) she was able to research in her records and pull out some more lineage to add to our pedigrees. We found out that Blanche is in the line. Before we new this I was always asking if she might be in the pedigree, too me she looks like a platinum, and sure enough she is in the line.


Tyler Cleckley
www.GliderBoyGliders.com
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: gliderboy4life] #799680
06/27/09 06:55 PM
06/27/09 06:55 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 16,798
St. Johns, Florida
Srlb Offline
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ok so if that is the case, it would not be correct to say that Haley and Silverbelle are the *Only* true platinum lines, correct?

I hope someone else sees why this is so confusing....


Peggy
Critter Love
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If you want to know what a person is like, watch how he treats others.

You'll never know what the outcome is if you don't step up and try.

Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Srlb] #799687
06/27/09 07:14 PM
06/27/09 07:14 PM
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Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
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Well, if theories are correct then, technically, the lines would be called "Blanch" and "Cereal". However, I think they're just being named after the first platinums that were RECOGNIZED as platinums.


~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Guerita135] #799717
06/27/09 09:13 PM
06/27/09 09:13 PM
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Sheila Offline
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Nicole, I am not sure that Silverbell is a platinum at all. I think she is a light glider and possibly a beautiful Champagne. She is however in the lineage of Dandy. Silverbelle is Dandy's mother and there is a good possibility that Blanch is his grandmother. Susan got Blanch later in life and she did not have that many babies for her. Some of her records on the old computer were destroyed. She is going to see if the oop date for Chester is the same as Mums. We know for certain that Blanch was Mum's mother. Susan said if she kept Chester to go with her colored breeding program he must have been lighter than a normal and that is why she would have kept him. Hopefully she will get to her records soon and get back to me as to whether they were born the same day. Also being older, she may not have bred for a while and she could have switched males with her.


ToandFro Gliders

http://www.toandfrogliders.com

USDA Licensed breeder for 12 years and counting!

WE SELL THE STEALTH WHEEL
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Sheila] #799718
06/27/09 09:14 PM
06/27/09 09:14 PM
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Posts: 5,363
Ok
Sheila Offline
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Nicole what you are saying in my response to Karin is correct. Karin, can you email me your lineage.


ToandFro Gliders

http://www.toandfrogliders.com

USDA Licensed breeder for 12 years and counting!

WE SELL THE STEALTH WHEEL
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Sheila] #799721
06/27/09 09:24 PM
06/27/09 09:24 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
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Ok
Sheila Offline
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I just found Prada's lineage. It is Schezwan that is out of Sunny and Pixie. At one time we thought that Pixie might be a het for Platinum because her sister produced one. That was probably 1-2 years ago I mentioned that to Karin. I think that Sunny is most likely a het because of the number of platinums that Comet has produced. She has had 11 joeys and three have been platinum and one Leucistic which I believe to be a platinum also. That Leucistic has had three platinum grandchildren produced. Now because it has been two more years and Schezwan has not produced any platinums, I would say there is a slim chance that Prada carries the gene.


ToandFro Gliders

http://www.toandfrogliders.com

USDA Licensed breeder for 12 years and counting!

WE SELL THE STEALTH WHEEL
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Sheila] #799724
06/27/09 09:28 PM
06/27/09 09:28 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 9,173
Edwardsville, Kansas 66113
Judie Offline
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And "Sunny" is out of Sandman and Sesamie. Sandman is out of Cereal.

Sandman WFB and Sprite WFB... Sprite was out of Ole Yeller and Blanch. And I think Peggy has one of those babies from me.



Edited post due to typing error of name.

Last edited by Judie; 06/27/09 09:35 PM.
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Judie] #799725
06/27/09 09:29 PM
06/27/09 09:29 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 5,363
Ok
Sheila Offline
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Judie, you mean Sunny cloud9

Last edited by Sheila; 06/27/09 09:30 PM.

ToandFro Gliders

http://www.toandfrogliders.com

USDA Licensed breeder for 12 years and counting!

WE SELL THE STEALTH WHEEL
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Sheila] #799726
06/27/09 09:32 PM
06/27/09 09:32 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 9,173
Edwardsville, Kansas 66113
Judie Offline
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Silly me. Yes, I meant to type Sunny.

Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Judie] #799729
06/27/09 09:48 PM
06/27/09 09:48 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 9,173
Edwardsville, Kansas 66113
Judie Offline
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The offspring of "Schezwan" have never been sold as Possible Platinum Hets. So, they probably have not been paired to produce Platinums. Remember, most of the males are altered and sold as Pets as WFB.

I have been sitting over here with my Cereal Gliders along with Schezwan, for years... and never did I know till recently that that any of them may be carriers of the Platinum Gene. Not till Jason did a paring with some of my wfb offspring that were paired to a glider that was a Het for Platinum out of one of Sheila's gliders did a I get a hint as to what was the connection to producing the Platinums.

??????

Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Judie] #799733
06/27/09 10:11 PM
06/27/09 10:11 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 5,363
Ok
Sheila Offline
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Schezwan had the potential of producing platinum with her mate and she did not so I would assume that she does not carry the gene.


ToandFro Gliders

http://www.toandfrogliders.com

USDA Licensed breeder for 12 years and counting!

WE SELL THE STEALTH WHEEL
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Sheila] #799750
06/27/09 11:05 PM
06/27/09 11:05 PM
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 11,583
Sycamore Illinois
Karin Offline
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(I don't know how you two do this smile ).

Ok, but daddy (Armani) is out of Sprite and Lucius. Is that the same Sprite?

Karin


Miss Lily and Bud
Prada and Armani
Tessa, Deuce and Cami

Tira and Misu angel Deja and Vu

Glider Daydreams



"Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass...It is about learning to
dance in the rain!"
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Karin] #799771
06/28/09 12:22 AM
06/28/09 12:22 AM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 16,798
St. Johns, Florida
Srlb Offline
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Quote:
And I think Peggy has one of those babies from me.


Judie, I dont have any babies from you. I do have some from others that have gotten babies from you though. Like Snuggle is actually from Streak and Scooter (Who I got from CKB) who is from Gabby and Tai Pan.

Sheila, thank you for clearing that up for me. I really do think I have scratched a bald spot on my head trying to figure this stuff out.

Karin, I am with you, I dont know how they do it neither. I wind up confusing myself and then have to back track and take it one glider at a time and write it all on paper in order to keep up with it all!! roflmao


Peggy
Critter Love
Critter Love� Diet Center

If you want to know what a person is like, watch how he treats others.

You'll never know what the outcome is if you don't step up and try.

Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Srlb] #799856
06/28/09 10:30 AM
06/28/09 10:30 AM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 841
Houston, Texas
gliderboy4life Offline
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Karin, according to KDR Lucious produced a platinum for him that did not make it so he then retired his mate, Daphne.

I have a glider out of Schezwan and Pai, he is not in the platinum line, because like Sheila said her mate should have produced platinum together.


Tyler Cleckley
www.GliderBoyGliders.com
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: gliderboy4life] #799942
06/28/09 02:36 PM
06/28/09 02:36 PM
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Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
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I also have Schezwan's sister, Leda, and she's got an extraordinary color! I have her paired with a leu boy from Haley and Mickey. So far, no platinums, but you guys KNOW I'll be shouting it around the world if they DO have one. roflmao

Here's the best pic I have that show's Leda's gorgeous coloring:



Man, I hope we can figure out the platinum gene soon! lol


~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Guerita135] #801227
07/01/09 10:45 AM
07/01/09 10:45 AM

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NGS
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Annabelle, from Caspian and Magnolia.

Also, Becca's gliders don't have Haley anywhere in their lineages

Nicole, I got confused with some of the things being said here.

Does Becca's line have haley or not? Thanks for the help smile

Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: ] #801232
07/01/09 11:01 AM
07/01/09 11:01 AM

B
Babydevilsangel
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Babydevilsangel
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I guess the reason the "haley" line is confusing is because then people go looking for Haley IN the line and find that she's just not there.

My platinums are from the exact same line as Haley is. But Haley is NOT in my platinums lineages.

We are still trying to figure and pinpoint (if possible) where this gene has originated from and how it works. Since we don't know... and since Haley was the first known platinum in this "line", it is appropriate to call it the Haley line.

If you look back in Haley's lineage, you'll find Frodo, Noel, Sammie, and Hope. If you back in Mr. Sambuca's lineage (as well as Mastika and Zeppi), you'll find those exact same ancestors.

Does that help tie it together? They are definitely from the same line. =)

Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: Sheila] #801321
07/01/09 04:05 PM
07/01/09 04:05 PM
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USA
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IowaMisty Offline
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USA
Originally Posted By: GliderNursery
This dilemma seems so easy to me to fix.

A "True Platinum" would be called a Platinum. This refers to the genetic coloration that everyone understands. (As indicated before, because Platinum is a genetic term it should only be used on a glider with that lineage.)

A "Platinum colored Mosaic" would be called a Silver Mosaic. This is the color only, just like a white mo, or a ringtail mo. That description tells everyone what color the mosaic is and speaks nothing of genetics (other than being a mo).

Let's face it, the platinum-color is silver. Why try to re-invent the terms? The mosaics in question are silver, why not just call them that?



I agree this would be a good way to clear this up. I think that changes started being made to the database before there was really a complete consensus on it & it hadn't even been mentioned as an option before to change the platinums to Silverbelle & Haley platinums.

Originally Posted By: Sheila
I see many statements here that need correcting. First starting with Mac. Starting on June 3 I decided to add some names to the Pet Glider Data Base. When I started to see the errors, I decided to try and get them corrected. I actually only entered about 5 of my gliders to that database. Many were already added by different people and the lineages were incorrect. In a conversation with Priscilla on the phone just prior to me making these corrections, I told her why the database was wrong giving her two examples - the one about Minnie and Mickey not being out of Ethan and Eileen and the one about Mac not being a platinum. Priscilla had no idea that Ethan was not always with Eileen. She had put in the database that Mac was a platinum and I reminded her that Mac had always produced normal colored gliders and Mosaics. Mac was described to me by Dai, the previous owner as a mosaic.


I did notice that both of these changes were made. Thanks for clarifying because when I went in & looked at my gliders' lineage & saw Eileen was missing & Mac was a mosaic, I thought for sure I was losing my mind. I wasn't breeding for platinum, but I was telling people that our joeys had some small amount of platinum in their lineage...and now it turns out that wasn't correct, which kind of stinks, but so far we have sold to pet-only homes, so it's ok.

I'm really hoping people get on board with this registry that some people are trying to create. I think it would help to correct some of these issues & prevent them from happening again. What would happen if some of you long-timers weren't around to remember these things? We'd forever have an incorrect database.

Misty

Re: Part 2: "Platinum" Can Mean 2 Different Things? [Re: IowaMisty] #801451
07/01/09 10:12 PM
07/01/09 10:12 PM

N
NGS
Unregistered
NGS
Unregistered
N



Originally Posted By: IowaMisty
[quote=GliderNursery]This dilemma seems so easy to me to fix.

A "True Platinum" would be called a Platinum. This refers to the genetic coloration that everyone understands. (As indicated before, because Platinum is a genetic term it should only be used on a glider with that lineage.)

A "Platinum colored Mosaic" would be called a Silver Mosaic. This is the color only, just like a white mo, or a ringtail mo. That description tells everyone what color the mosaic is and speaks nothing of genetics (other than being a mo).

Let's face it, the platinum-color is silver. Why try to re-invent the terms? The mosaics in question are silver, why not just call them that?



I agree this would be a good way to clear this up. I think that changes started being made to the database before there was really a complete consensus on it & it hadn't even been mentioned as an option before to change the platinums to Silverbelle & Haley platinums. Misty



I agree with this, makes more sense to me too. smile

I thought this from the start that silver was the better answer to this problem.

Last edited by NGS; 07/01/09 10:22 PM.
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