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Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" #604623
08/05/08 05:58 AM
08/05/08 05:58 AM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,788
Cleveland, Ohio
sugarglidersuz Offline OP
Glideritis Anonymous
sugarglidersuz  Offline OP
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,788
Cleveland, Ohio
Please see Part 1 of this topic HERE


Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders
Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: sugarglidersuz] #604624
08/05/08 06:13 AM
08/05/08 06:13 AM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,788
Cleveland, Ohio
sugarglidersuz Offline OP
Glideritis Anonymous
sugarglidersuz  Offline OP
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,788
Cleveland, Ohio
As I've considered this topic further, I have come to a possible solution:
What if, instead of having items sent to "approvers" at the outset, we set a standard for glider safety? We could call it something like Sugar Glider Safety Guard Standards (SGSG Standards) and have a very specific set of guidelines. Those vendors who believe their products follow those guidelines could then post the "seal" on their site/ads and make the claim "Made according to SGSG Standards". Then, IF someone felt they received a product with that "seal & claim" that they felt was NOT within the guidelines for some reason, they could then send their product to the "SGSG Standards Board" with an explanation of their "complaint". That complaint could be reviewed by the board and either validated or refuted with an explanation for the validation or refution sent to the vendor who made/sold the item and to the original purchaser. That vendor would then have the opportunity to fix the issue (if necessary), within a set amount of time, and to "make it right" with the original purchaser, either by replacing the item with a new item truly made according to the standards OR by issuing a refund. If the issue was then not corrected accordingly to fall within the guidelines of the standards, then the board could require the vendor to remove the "seal & claim" from that product line.
The "SGSG Standards Board" could be compiled of 3-5 well-known and respected persons within the community whose own products comply with the established guidelines. There would be a "chain of inspection" whereby the complainant would send the item to the first person, who would then send it to the next, and so on. The board would then review their respective inspections with each other and come to a consensus about the product before making the notification of complaint validation or refution.

What does everyone think? Would this be a more viable option?


Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders
Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: sugarglidersuz] #604646
08/05/08 07:42 AM
08/05/08 07:42 AM

T
tryne
Unregistered
tryne
Unregistered
T



suz, i think you've solved it.
that seems a LOT more feasable

Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: ] #604709
08/05/08 09:45 AM
08/05/08 09:45 AM

K
Kaczie
Unregistered
Kaczie
Unregistered
K



Yes Suz!
Definately like that idea.

Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: ] #604770
08/05/08 11:13 AM
08/05/08 11:13 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,402
Michigan
G
gliderma Offline
Serious Glideritis
gliderma  Offline
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G

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,402
Michigan
sounds great! Can we still have the contest to design the seal?


Lynn Martel
616-272-4374
989-400-5686
Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: gliderma] #605066
08/05/08 05:55 PM
08/05/08 05:55 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
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Guerita135  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
The problem is: everyone has their own opinion of what is safe.

THAT is why we ahould have people who KNOW what's safe/unsafe to approve bedding.

Just because someone is 100% sure that their bedding is safe, doesn't mean that it is. I recently saw a post on another forum where a new vendor was selling BEAUTIFUL pouches that she had created. However, they were made with "furry fleece", which is extremely dangerous because gliders can easily get their little feet caught in the strings. Anyways, the point is that I'm sure she's not intentially making unsafe pouches, she just doesn't know any better. I think that's why people are so afraid to buy from newbies, not because they make bad bedding, but because some of them jsut don't know any better.

I'm hoping that by appointing people to approve bedding then it will help newbies to learn how to make bedding properly and will give buyers the confidence to know that that person's bedding is safe because it's been checked by experienced, knowledgeable people in the glider community. smile

I've scratched the poll because it's been pointed out to me that 1) things need to get settled out first and 2) having a poll might be an altogether bad idea. It would probably be best to jsut stick to having a couple members in charge that have been around for a while, know how to sew, and are unbaised against people based on their past/current relationship with that person or their status as a member(newbie/oldie). The first 3 people that come to my mind are Suz, Karin, and Alicia(queenduck). If they would be willing to volunteer for this(Suz and Karin are in, but we'd have to gang up on Alicia to force her to join in, lol) then I think that it would eliminate the need to have "levels" of approvement or to even have more then one person check a piece of bedding because all 3 ladies that I just listed are experience in making, selling, buying, and having their gliders test their bedding. wink There would be no need to doubt their approval because they're all going to have the same opinions on what is safe/unsafe because they've been around long enough to know the difference.



~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: Guerita135] #605070
08/05/08 05:59 PM
08/05/08 05:59 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
Glider Addict
Guerita135  Offline
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Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Suz, I just read your response(sorry, I was too lazy to read everything and wanted to get my long post typed up first.

I was thinking that, if possible, it would be nice to set up a website dedicated to it that will not only list the vednors that are approved, but also will list what makes bedding safe/unsafe. That way people know what to look for and will also know what to do/not to do when making their own bedding for their gliders or if they plan on becoming a vendor.

I'm not sure how well things would work by simply letting everyone put the stamp on their sire because they say that their bedding passes all the standards because that would open the door for people to lie about it. :\ I mean, I guess if my idea is just too complicated then we could use your idea, but, personally, I wouldn't trust someone who put the stamp on their site without having their bedding approved by an experienced member. There are too many times that I've seen/read about vendors who only see $$$ and will lie to get it. frown


~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: Guerita135] #605071
08/05/08 06:00 PM
08/05/08 06:00 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
Glider Addict
Guerita135  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Oh yeah, here's a reponse I typed on LGG that I think someone here discussed as well, so I'll post it here too:

"As for what was said about vendors possibly lowering their standards AFTER being approved... I think that if something like that were to happen and someone were to buy from someone on the list and see that it was NOT safe, then they would be punished by IMMEDIATELY being taken off the approved list and NEVER being allow to gain back the "approved" status. It seems harsh, but when it comes to putting the lives of our babies in the hands of a vendor, then it NEEDS to be serious!"


~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: Guerita135] #605115
08/05/08 06:36 PM
08/05/08 06:36 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 625
Dallas, Texas
cbddallas Offline
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cbddallas  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 625
Dallas, Texas
I'll start by saying, I'm not trying to offend anyone - this is just my opinion.

I think we're over-engineering a solution to something that isn't really a problem. Wouldn't it be easier to just ask Karin or Cheryl or Suz, or whoever, to let a person use them as a reference? And isn't that what this basically is, anyway? I mean, if you don't know who Karin, or Suz, or any of these "approvers" are, why would you give any credibility to their reference? And if you do know who they are, a vendor who can list them as a reference has accomplished the same thing without creating a massive oversight problem.

What happened to vendors getting their reputation the old-fashioned way - by earning it?


Cindy, Wife to Dee and Mom to:
two beautiful daughters, Kendall & Reagan,
one handsome son, Dee IV,
one silly American Eskimo, Jasmine,
and our four gliders, the "big kids", aka Bella & Beau, and "the babies" Kandy & Kane, from Cora!
Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: Guerita135] #605118
08/05/08 06:38 PM
08/05/08 06:38 PM

M
Mio
Unregistered
Mio
Unregistered
M



I think it'd be too easy to lie about it in general. I could throw together a pouch myself, and claim that it is approved by glider experts worldwide- used by zookeepers in Australia... whatever you like. So the "seal" is just another thing that'd be easy to copy and paste...

Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: cbddallas] #605126
08/05/08 06:44 PM
08/05/08 06:44 PM

M
Monster
Unregistered
Monster
Unregistered
M



Originally Posted By: cbddallas
What happened to vendors getting their reputation the old-fashioned way - by earning it?


clap agree

Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: ] #605142
08/05/08 07:12 PM
08/05/08 07:12 PM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,346
Mobile,Alabama
jannee66 Offline
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jannee66  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,346
Mobile,Alabama
Originally Posted By: Monster
Originally Posted By: cbddallas
What happened to vendors getting their reputation the old-fashioned way - by earning it?


clap agree


clap agree clap agree clap agree clap agree

Also what's safe for one glider may not be safe enough for another.
Who's gonna check the checkers?
I personally received a pouch make by a well known "top" seamstress, who was even suggested to be on the board of approvers, I guess she forgot the back stitch the seam because it was coming apart with hanging threads showing, that's considered unsafe. I didn't complain, because EVERYTHING else she made for me was PERFECT! I simply corrected the mistake myself. Did I order from her again? Yes I sure did, because ANYONE can make a mistake, that's why we should check for safety everyday regardless of who made it.


wave Jannie

I heart my Sweet Spellbinding Sugar :glider:s

Glider Kisses
Pouches and Cage Sets



Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: jannee66] #605893
08/06/08 05:41 PM
08/06/08 05:41 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 803
Ontario, Canada
scraptilldawn Offline
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scraptilldawn  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 803
Ontario, Canada
As a newer vendor, and one coming from Canada to boot, I really liked this idea with the testing and the stamps. Not only for the good of the glider but for what it could do for my business personally. It is hard to get noticed with such widely respected vendors around and when you are trying your darnedest to generate business and being greatly overshadowed it gets discouraging. upset (I do realize this is business) I know my products are well liked and great for gliders as my customers tell me and return again and again for more. But getting New buyers is tough because they don't see or recognize your name as much as others and can't know that your items are certain to be safe. I've received items from other "Famed vendors" that has fallen apart on the first washing, and I have friends that have had the same issue. But because they are so popular it doesn't seem to be an issue. Or maybe it was a coincidental thing. Bottom line, I'd love to have a veteran that I'd trust to look over my items and give their approval for all to see. I'm glad for every gift exchange opportunity that I have to send items out to those I respect and to hear back that I've made the grade blush This whole project would be great for those like me who are trying to get there suggie lines going as a full/part time thing. smile

Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: scraptilldawn] #606180
08/06/08 10:57 PM
08/06/08 10:57 PM
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,148
TX
tootles Offline
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tootles  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,148
TX
one of my questions is if you don't send your items to be tested by these people then does that mean you cannot sell anymore??? Does that mean noone will buy from you???


Tracy

Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: tootles] #606185
08/06/08 10:59 PM
08/06/08 10:59 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 11,158
Tampa, FL
Xglider Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
Xglider  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 11,158
Tampa, FL
I love the "Idea" of testers and all .. but not having the stamp .. at this time .. i belive... will not stop some one from being able to vend ...


I have used testers to try out some of my new toys ... to help me develope them ...

Last edited by Xglider; 08/06/08 11:00 PM.

* ~ * John * ~ * Sorry store is closed at this time.. <br>
Link -> ~~ XtremeGlider ~~ Home of the original Re~set Toys! ~~ <br>
Oct 2012 update.. miss my gliders and my
glider family and think of my friends often!!!
Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: tootles] #606188
08/06/08 11:00 PM
08/06/08 11:00 PM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
Guerita135 Offline
Glider Addict
Guerita135  Offline
Glider Addict

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,645
Ohio
No, of course not, it's entirely voluntary. the only purpose is so that 1) people will know who sells 100% safe bedding and 2)newbies can get more buyers because people will know that their stuff is safe.

I've noticed that the main reason that people won't buy from newbies is because they don't trust that the bedding is safe. This is to help buyers and vendors both. wink


~Nicole~

Proudly enslaved by lots of silly suggies, 3 crazy kitties, a huffy hedgie, and a pretty puppy! grin
Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: Guerita135] #606194
08/06/08 11:16 PM
08/06/08 11:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,983
Denton, TX
ValkyrieMome Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
ValkyrieMome  Offline
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Posts: 10,983
Denton, TX
Originally Posted By: Guerita135
The problem is: everyone has their own opinion of what is safe.


That's why having a Standard of Safety would be a good idea. It would get everyone on the same page. The Standard could be devised to the strongest standards, not the weakest link.


Alden
"Animals can communicate quite well. And they do. And generally speaking, they are ignored." Alice Walker


Mom to Valhalla; 6 cats; 1 macaw; 2 hedgehogs;
and very many great gliders!

(plus the 2 skin kids)
valkyriegliders.com

Kyrie, nothing will ever fill the hole you left in my heart.
Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: ValkyrieMome] #606322
08/07/08 03:11 AM
08/07/08 03:11 AM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,830
USA
SugarBlossoms Offline
Serious Glideritis
SugarBlossoms  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,830
USA
Wow! I just read this and I must say that Suz, you have the best idea yet!!


Keeper of Handprints on my Heart, You left your Footprints on my soul.
My precious loves that left to quickly, Peanut, Katie
Isabella, Kiwi, Bonnie and Monroe.

Spread your wings and glide free of pain,
Until the day I see you again.

God speed my precious angels. I love you. Mama.
Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: Guerita135] #606332
08/07/08 03:44 AM
08/07/08 03:44 AM

7
7glider7
Unregistered
7glider7
Unregistered
7



Originally Posted By: Guerita135
The problem is: everyone has their own opinion of what is safe.

Just because someone is 100% sure that their bedding is safe, doesn't mean that it is. I recently saw a post on another forum where a new vendor was selling BEAUTIFUL pouches that she had created. However, they were made with "furry fleece", which is extremely dangerous because gliders can easily get their little feet caught in the strings. Anyways, the point is that I'm sure she's not intentially making unsafe pouches, she just doesn't know any better. I think that's why people are so afraid to buy from newbies, not because they make bad bedding, but because some of them jsut don't know any better.


Yes, it is somewhat of an opinion of what is safe and unsafe...which is why I'm unsure of how anyone would be qualified to decide what is safe and unsafe and "police" it. You are really talking about assembling a police force of people to declare what is safe and unsafe, put people on a list, remove them from a list, etc...really it IS somewhat subjective what is safe, as even safe bedding can deteriorate over time...so do you remove this person from the list? It is a very slippery slope, and I could see it becoming very political. Is someone really going to monitor this list all the time, and add vendors to it, and remove them if their product quality declines? It sounds like an immense amount of work that would be difficult to do fairly.

Also, if a newbie doesn't know enough not to buy furry fleece, why would they know what the "Glider Safe Stamp" means and know that this is any more valid than a vendor proclaiming their product to be safe?

I appreciate your thought in terms of wanting to make sure gliders are safe. But why don't we educate newbies and let them decide for themselves instead of creating some kind of potentially political/policing group for it. It just seems like you couldn't possibly make it totally objective dunno and it seems like it could create a lot of hard feelings in an arena where competing for customers can already be pretty competitive.

Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: ] #630074
09/07/08 10:21 AM
09/07/08 10:21 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,997
Upstate, SC
SariYappa Offline
Serious Glideritis
SariYappa  Offline
Serious Glideritis

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,997
Upstate, SC
Soooooooooo,
How about getting a list of what is "safe" and getting opinions on it, and getting a safety list started????
We don't have to worry about how/when/where it will be posted yet. Let's just get started on the one idea here that is useful, to get a standard safety list. Things that are PROVEN to be safe, or more importantly, unsafe.
ie: Safe: no-pill fleece unsafe: heat rocks...

What do we think??????????????
Everyone can have an input, and then the "disagreements" can be settled with history and facts. There can even be a "sometimes" or a "under certain conditions" list. Like toys only for tent time, or "if you don't have a biter".

And, if this is acceptable, then lets start a new thread! smile


*Whatever I said, I said it with a Smile*

wave Sari

:grey:Sugar:grey:Nibbles:grey:Destiny

Rapid Runner *Sold Out!

Suggie Smart Mart *Home of The Hippie Pouch & Suggie Chandelier
Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: SariYappa] #630089
09/07/08 11:24 AM
09/07/08 11:24 AM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,083
Manitowoc, WI
BeckiT Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
BeckiT  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,083
Manitowoc, WI
I like the idea of a safe/unsafe list, even if it's just for a person to know what's safe and unsafe

Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: cbddallas] #630188
09/07/08 02:13 PM
09/07/08 02:13 PM
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 11,015
MA
pappy1264 Offline
Glideritis Anonymous
pappy1264  Offline
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 11,015
MA
Cindy, I agree with you on this one.......


Timmy, Gidget(RIP), Bandit, Petey(RIP), Phoebe, Jake (RIP) Piper(RIP), Pru(RIP), Paige, Cole, Molly(RIP), Oliver, Wyatt, Roo(RIP), Romeo, Pennie, Mandy(RIP), Madison, Garth, Kikipoo, Stasia, Bella, Petunia(RIP), Helen, Sydney, Kizzy and Sweet Pea's mom,
Mary
Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: pappy1264] #630298
09/07/08 04:09 PM
09/07/08 04:09 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,788
Cleveland, Ohio
sugarglidersuz Offline OP
Glideritis Anonymous
sugarglidersuz  Offline OP
Glideritis Anonymous

Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,788
Cleveland, Ohio
Truthfully, we already have -2- great starts to this right here on GC... In the Housing & Accessories forum there are two "stickies":
Hazardous toys or toy parts list
Safe Sleeping

I am in the process of figuring out the best way to format the information to make it an "easy reference" guide that I will add to my web-site. If you have any ideas of things to add, please post it here thumb


Suz Enyedy
:bb: Carina & Coobah
Allira & Gizmo :grey:
:grey: Picasso, Trinity Joy & Luna
:rbridge: DaisyMae; Darwin; Mareki; Mambo; Pika; Cricky; Reggie & Bobo, Pepe & Bittah


Suz' Sugar Gliders
Re: Part 2: Glider Bedding "Approvers" [Re: sugarglidersuz] #636898
09/16/08 08:38 AM
09/16/08 08:38 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,997
Upstate, SC
SariYappa Offline
Serious Glideritis
SariYappa  Offline
Serious Glideritis

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,997
Upstate, SC
clap Suz! clap
Thanks for the links, they too are very helpful


*Whatever I said, I said it with a Smile*

wave Sari

:grey:Sugar:grey:Nibbles:grey:Destiny

Rapid Runner *Sold Out!

Suggie Smart Mart *Home of The Hippie Pouch & Suggie Chandelier

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